Curse

jhand · May 03, 2011, 06:14 AM // 06:14

The ranger was my first profession in Guild Wars, and is definitely still my favorite. The skills have been changed drastically since the early days, many for the worse. The ranger, (along with a couple others), is definitely lacking what it use to have so much of. It is too difficult to create a ranger build with purely primary profession skills, that can compete with any other profession in the game.(besides paragons

)

With that being said, I make this thread to present two very simple ideas in which could improve the ranger, with little to no effort. Let me also say that I do not want this thread to simply contain my post, followed by numerous critiques and arguments against it. Instead I hope to see a thread where each post also gives one or two simple suggestions on how to make the ranger a more enjoyable class again.(Not to say that it cannot be enjoyable at the moment.)

The only guidelines I want to introduce are these;
1. Keep it as simple as possible, do not produce a complete overhaul of the nature ritual system, or a restructuring of the skill trees.
2. Try not to have the rangers fun factor rely on secondary profession skills, or other professions buffs, pve only skills.

Now, heres my quick and simple ideas.

1. Buff a few (5-10) of the absolute worst ranger skills to be on par with the rest. Examples;
--Debilitating shot - If foe is suffering from a condition, you gain 3..12 energy. 5 sec recharge. 1 sec cast.
--Precision shot - moves twice as fast, does +5..25. not easily interrupted.
--Marauder shot - deals +5..20 dmg, results in a critical hit if target is bleeding. 5e. 6 sec recharge. 1 sec cast.

2. Second is similar to the first, but instead of buffing the worst skills, improve Ranger dps by buffing preparations.

Lastly I'll say that of course these changes are not to fix the class entirely, but simply give them a little more standing in pve, where the only need is to hit for big numbers.

Kojima · May 03, 2011, 07:15 AM // 07:15

For me, I feel the recharge time for spirit skills needs to be decreased.

When I put Frozen Soil with a few ritualist spirit skills, the rit skills recharges a lot faster than my ranger spirit skill did. Same goes with Winter.

Coast · May 03, 2011, 07:24 AM // 07:24

reduce cast time of spirits to 0,75second cast instead of 5 in pve, reduce recharges by 15seconds on all spirits with 60sec or longer recharge(if theres any with longer recharge)

Olle · May 03, 2011, 07:29 AM // 07:29

To me, ur simple ways to improve the ranger just makes me think that the new meta is rangerspike, so no, the ranger is fine atm.

akelarumi · May 03, 2011, 07:48 AM // 07:48

Most nature ritual's have a different use. They are creating a rather large area effect. A (good) ranger put's them at a place where they stay active the entire duration without being killed. spirits function more as a meatshield that does direct damage. Their range is significant shorter, making them easier targets to be destroyed. So shorter recharge for spirits makes sense.

What I think would be a good buff for rangers, is basicly adding one elite skill (or totally changing one useless skill).

Summons 3 pets (lvl5-10) for 240 second. The type of pet would be the "local" wildlife (e.g. in Ferndale you get 3 white tigers). considering it would be your pets, you can use all pet-skills on them.

With some tweaking of some of the pet-skills, this would change the experience for rangers a lot.

Like SoS for spirits, there should be a split for PvP. rangers don't have any real problems in PvP.

The thing with a single pet is that they are alone, therefor don't funtion as a proper meatshield with 4 pets (the 3 summoned pets and your normal one) you would have a decent meatshield like SoS or minions. The durablility could be boosted with the pet skills.

depeche · May 03, 2011, 08:05 AM // 08:05

Don't know about PVE, but the ranger is still as viable as it ever was in PvP.

Talking about gvg for instance, the ranger is a true asset with his condition spreading, his unblockable cripshot and his rupts.
So .. no I don't want a buff to ranger skills, meaning the ranger isn't about DPS, he is about pressure.

Amy Awien · May 03, 2011, 08:43 AM // 08:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by akelarumi

Most nature ritual's have a different use. They are creating a rather large area effect. A (good) ranger put's them at a place where they stay active the entire duration without being killed.

The problem with the long recharge nature rituals is not that you have to place them out of harms way, but that, while progressing through an area, you move out of it's range to quickly.

The second problem is having skills with long activation times on a character that is traditionally used for pulling mobs - and that just doesn't work to well.

Bringing a preparation and a nature ritual in a group of humans just doesn't work, you have a five second cast, in a safe spot so then you have to move to the place where you plan to have the fight, then cast you preparations. It just takes too long.

Quote:

Summons 3 pets (lvl5-10) for 240 second. The type of pet would be the "local" wildlife (e.g. in Ferndale you get 3 white tigers). considering it would be your pets, you can use all pet-skills on them.

A bit like the old version of Otyugh's Cry. This 'local wildlife' part was considered so bad that people overlooked the good part of the skill. The basic thought isn't bad though, summoning x extra pets, but only if they're of sufficient level and can be buffed.

Aldric · May 03, 2011, 10:53 AM // 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by kajusbonus

To me, ur simple ways to improve the ranger just makes me think that the new meta is rangerspike, so no, the ranger is fine atm.

Quote:

Originally Posted by depeche

Don't know about PVE, but the ranger is still as viable as it ever was in PvP.

Talking about gvg for instance, the ranger is a true asset with his condition spreading, his unblockable cripshot and his rupts.
So .. no I don't want a buff to ranger skills, meaning the ranger isn't about DPS, he is about pressure.

The OP does say "in pve" so the fact that pvp ranger is excellent has no real baring on anything at all, pveE rangers do suffer for being one of the least effective classes to bring into a party.

Bow attacks - Small buff to numbers, maybe add a longish recharge DW. Barrage/Volley not removing preps.
Preps - Small buff and change duration to scale with attribute. "For 12..36..48 secs your arrows blowshitup"
Spirits - Ritualist style cast and recharge times. Maybe some functionality changes to give some of them them party only buffs, eg +armour/health regen/etc

Rather than just a huge buff yellow numbers i'd like to see some better party support introduced. When i played with my guild i often ran R/W SY or even R/D blindbot & Cripplebots which was at least useful

I like the idea of summoning multiple pets though

Coast · May 03, 2011, 11:21 AM // 11:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldric

Spirits - Ritualist style cast and recharge times. Maybe some functionality changes to give some of them them party only buffs, eg +armour/health regen/etc

I think we alrdy got this: fertile seasons/symbiosis(well hp+armor)
Also don't want to see some spirits nerfed with a functionality change: eoe comes in mind(don't kill this spirit)

PurpleFission · May 03, 2011, 01:11 PM // 13:11

Preparations need a longer duration and about a 1sec casting time.
That and nature rituals need a shorter cast + increased aoe. ie. Halfway between current range and compass range would be nice.

Franksalot · May 03, 2011, 03:23 PM // 15:23

Main issue i have with ranger is preperations, they not really "pre" as they have a duration, when you use a preperation it should prepare so many arrows and these arrows stay prepared until you fire them. IE the next 10 shots will have the prep effect regardless of how long you take to use them. To balance it out and keep it ranger only make the amount of arrows you can stack up scale with expertise. IE 3 arrows per level or w/e number works best. Any skill that hits more than once, IE daul shot would consume 2 arrows.

Xiaquin · May 03, 2011, 04:42 PM // 16:42

Hmm, only two?

Suggestions are intended for PvE-only:

1) Activation and recharge times of skills, especially preparations and nature rituals, reduced dramatically across the board.

2) Rework all attack skills to improve efficiency and damage, and weave more and greater conditions and adverse effects to the enemy into them.

*shrug* Doesn't include a fix to traps, but I could live with them as-is if we were to get the above.

Xsiriss · May 03, 2011, 04:57 PM // 16:57

As I've said with many ranger suggestion, nature rituals and traps are just gimmicky and should be left for GW2. Instead the true intent of the ranger should be focused on, preparations and bow attacks. Another main problem of a ranger in PvE is energy, the best form of it comes in the form of the elite Prepared Shot. This obviously cuts down your damage capabilities.

I'd suggest making changes to preparations so their durations are lengthened considerably (like double), with the downside of disabling non ranger (PvE skills unaffected) skills for 10seconds. And maybe the possibility of multipled preparations through a reworking of Practiced Stance OR having them act like maintained enchantments.

Bow attacks need their recharge and bonus damage checked, that should be enough. (Maybe link something in to expertise to make bow attacks recharge 2% faster for each rank?).

I do like the suggestion for debilitating shot, though I'd lower the energy cost to 5 and up recharge to 8 or 10

I like the suggestion for delibating shot. Though I would

yayowars · May 03, 2011, 05:02 PM // 17:02

PvE only of course...

I would propose an added effect to the expertise attribute, higher ranks result in higher damage if target has X amount of conditions, let's say 3 or more; just to not abuse said buff.

And maybe have preparations act like flash enchantments (instant "cast" time) when expertise is at level 13 and above.

Also I'd like to second Franksalot's idea.

Sparks Of Fire · May 03, 2011, 05:32 PM // 17:32

For PvE only:

Any skill that has the words "pet" or "animal Companion" should allow you to have a pet with you....no need for Comfort Animal or any of the other limited skills that allow you to have a pet.

The logic here is if you are using these skills you obviously want to have a pet with you.

Other than that the ranger is fine in my opinion.

Alathin · May 03, 2011, 06:20 PM // 18:20

How about for PvE only:

Barrage does not remove preparations
Or if that is to overpowered, have barrage not remove preparations but the preparations are weakened by 50...20% depending on marksmanship or expertise or something...?

AlsoSol · May 03, 2011, 06:21 PM // 18:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franksalot

Main issue i have with ranger is preperations, they not really "pre" as they have a duration, when you use a preperation it should prepare so many arrows and these arrows stay prepared until you fire them. IE the next 10 shots will have the prep effect regardless of how long you take to use them. To balance it out and keep it ranger only make the amount of arrows you can stack up scale with expertise. IE 3 arrows per level or w/e number works best. Any skill that hits more than once, IE daul shot would consume 2 arrows.

This sounds like a great idea. How many arrows do you usually shoot in the 24 second average that the preparation lasts? Ten may seem fine, but without a change to bow damage in PvE and in the later areas with larger mobs, those ten arrows go quickly.

My suggestions:

1 - Introduction of adrenal skills (most needed would be 4-6 strikes of adrenaline) - I think this makes sense for all physical classes. Might slow down combat, though.

2 - General buff to damage. Would probably have to be through preparations or something. Would like to see a ranger update soon, though.

Amy Awien · May 03, 2011, 08:05 PM // 20:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franksalot

... when you use a preperation it should prepare so many arrows and these arrows stay prepared until you fire them. IE the next 10 shots will have the prep effect regardless of how long you take to use them.

Interesting idea - that could work to prevent Barrage/Volley from becoming overpowered without their 'removes preparation' clauses.

A problem arises with those preparations that affect all attacks rather then arrows, they have uses without a bow and should remain useful without one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparks Of Fire

... no need for Comfort Animal or any of the other limited skills that allow you to have a pet. ...

You need a pet rezz, rarely I admit that, but still. Unless you make a zoo-team and bring that Revive skill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alathin

Barrage does not remove preparations
Or if that is to overpowered, have barrage not remove preparations but the preparations are weakened by 50...20% depending on marksmanship or expertise or something...?

Barrage + Ignite + EBSoH could come close to a win button. But the marksmanship preps wouldn't be so immediately overpowering, so maybe limit the removal to the non-marksmanship preps.

Fay Vert · May 03, 2011, 08:58 PM // 20:58

The problem with all these suggestions is that ANet aren't going to touch rangers again ever, regardless of how uselsss they are in PvE. Just better hope they don't mess up so bad in GW2

jhand · May 03, 2011, 10:07 PM // 22:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fay Vert

The problem with all these suggestions is that ANet aren't going to touch rangers again ever, regardless of how uselsss they are in PvE. Just better hope they don't mess up so bad in GW2

Even if this were absolutely true, since no one can possibly know that there will never be another skill balance update containing ranger buffs, even if it only changes about 10 ranger skills, it is still interesting to see people ideas, especially if they are very simple yet drastically improves the class. It's never a bad thing for people to think and provide input. Plus the simpler the idea is, it could be realistic to see them implement it in game.